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29th
APR
All Empires have an expiry date; whether it’s the Persian Empire with its 48 nations, or it’s the United States with its 50 states and few puppet countries
Posted by Ali Sanaei under Geography, History and Archeology, Iran, Middle East, Politics, USA, United Kingdom
| “ | Here was a source of great fear to us.So formidable does the Sassanid king seem to our eastern legions, that some are liable to go over to him, and others are unwilling to fight at all.” | ” |
This was written by the Roman historian and public servant, Cassius Dio During the battles between the Sassanid Empire and the Roman Empire (27 BC - 476 CE), which caused such pessimism in Rome that the historian wrote like that.
The Persia (Iran) geographical map during Sassanid Empire (224 - 651 CE) was as follow:
This map shows that the Persian Empire used to cover many current Middle Eastern and Central Asian countries including the whole Iran itself, Iraq, Kuwait, Turkmenistan, Armenia, Azerbaijan, Georgia, Uzbekistan, Turkey, Syria, Jordan, Palestine, Israel (Occupied Palestine), UAE, Bahrain, Qatar, Yemen, Oman, then most of Afghanistan, Pakistan, Tajikistan, Lebanon, Kyrgyzstan, Egypt and finally a part of India, Kazakhstan, Russia, Libya and Saudi Arabia.
I want to mention that all enormous empires have existed one day and have expired few days after, this is an important lesson from world’s history. Babylonian Empire, Egyptian Empire, Persian Empires, Roman Empire, Chinese Empire, Arab Empire, Portuguese and Spanish Empires, British Empire, French Empire, German Colonial Empire, etc. These were all before the 20th century. Even the 20th century’s empires such as Nazi and Soviet Union are gone now. And today it seems the only empire - if you could call it so - is the United States of America.
I’m not going to write further today, but just to say that as a historical rule; USA’s time will come sooner or later, but if the next American presidents follow Bush’s “Avarice Policies” and behaviours with gunboats, phantoms and tanks in the name of democracy, that will make United States’ time approach faster.
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April 29, 2007 -
Geography, History and Archeology, Iran, Middle East, Politics, USA, United Kingdom -
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I don’t know if you’ve seen this site…http://www.sorryeverybody.com/
They made it after the second US election. see the photo gallery…
salam! mamnonam az inke be man sar zadid! moteasefane forsate tarjomeye kamel nadashtam be joz titre matlab. bazam mamnonam. movafag bashid!
your site is amazing and so ineresting! I injoy it!
GOOD !!!
Salam
Webloge kheili por matlabi darid,moshakhase ke roosh vaght gozashtin o kar mikonin,
Khaste nabashid.
kenaye siasitoon harf nadare :)
hi,
You’ve got a nice weblog and i like it this way :-)
wish we would hear more and more from each other.
Best Regards,
Mehdi
Hi Ali
Thanks for the weblink,very interesting opinions that the world doesn’t know.
saudações…talvez o mais provavel é que você não entenda o que eu vou falar agora…mas é o seguinte, eu recebi uma mensagem sua, talvez você seja moderador de alguma comunidade…então visitei o seu profile e dei uma olhada em suas fotos…foi somente isso Ok…fica tranquilo…me interessei bastante pelo seu Blog..
the one that I spoke in summary is that your blog is very interesting and I want to visit your blog more times…
I saw some interesting issues on your blog as i browsed through it. I’ll surely read some of it and let you know of my thoughts.
Good Job, Keep it up.
Ali Aaghaa Salaam.
Avvalan Bebakhshin Keh Dir Shod Taa Javaab-et-o Bedam; Raast-esh In Moddat Har Ki Az Raa Mireseh Az Maa Peyper Mikhaad! ;))
Dovvoman Inkeh Az Didan-e Weblog-et Lezzat Bordam. Dast Marizaad! =D> Haghighat-esh Nemidoonam Cheghad Azat Vakh Bordeh, Ammaa Bishtar-e Aadam-aa-i Keh Weblog Mizanan, Ba’d Az Moddat-i Khasteh Mishan Beh Khaater-e Workload. Omidvaaram Keh To Betooni Khoob Modiriyat Koni. 8->
Sevvoman Keh Neveshteh Boodi Keh Ghalamrov-e Saasaaniyaan Shaamel Esraa’il-am Mishodeh. Dar Towzih Arz Shavad Keh Esraa’il Keh “Keshvar” Nis Keh; Yani “Khaak” Nis Keh Bekhaad Mashomool-e Ghalamrov Sheh. Oonjaa Felestin-eh Keh Yeh Seri Aadamkosh Yeh Dowlat Beh Naam-e Khod-e-shoon Sabt Kardan Toosh. Banaabarin Ghalamrov-e Saasaaniyaan Shaamel-e Felestin Mishodeh Na Esraail.
It always makes me laugh that the only people that don’t believe that the US is an Empire is Americans! Even though they conquered Hawaii, Puerto Rico, one is now a state, the other a ‘dependency’ aka colony. They tried to take Canada off the British, and lost. They took huge chunks out of Mexico. Destroyed the Filipino freedom movement and conquered the Philippines, had Cuba as a colony, still have many Atlantic and Pacific Islands as colonies and have more troops stationed abroad than any other nation since the British Empire. And now of course they have Afghanistan and Iraq.
It may not be as large as other Empires but it is more powerful than many.
Oh and:
“Well, this was a huge empire which had the most land ever in world’s history.”
Not quite true. Both the British and Mongol Empires were bigger.
Hey Max,
You’re not right, America isn’t larger than the Persian empire.
First of all at that time, the world’s civilization was only in Asia, mainly in the Middle East and a part of China. The Middle East was part of the Persian Empire that time, excluding the central part of the current Saudi Arabia which was only desert and no point to fight for it! So at that time, Persia was like 75% of the whole civilized world!!
In the other hand, the Persian empire lasted for some 1600 years, while Rome was much less than half of this, and also all other empires, including American -if called an empire really!
Besides, Iraq and Afghanistan are not colonies in any possible way.
Hi Taroona,
I’m sorry, I think that you misunderstood me. I didn’t say that the US Empire was bigger than the Persian Empire, I said that the Mongol and British Empires were. However the US Empire at it’s greatest extent (10 million square kilometres) was in fact bigger than the Persian Empire at it’s greatest extent (7.5 million square kilometres - roughly the same size as the Japanese Empire during WWII).
I’d have to disagree about Iraq and Afghanistan not being colonies. There are currently 160,000 US troops stationed in Iraq under the command of the US administration, that act independently and without needing the permission of the Iraqi Government. That means that to all intents and purposes Iraq does as it is told. It is a similar story in Afghanistan.
Also most of Iraq’s oil goes through US companies and most of Iraq’s imports are from the US, in fact they are one of the biggest importers of US goods in the world at present. If that is not a colony, then the British Empire never existed.
Mac,
Taroona pointed to a good point. The Persian’s had almost the whole civilized world, so if you look at it like that, they were probably the largest empire in the world.
I somehow may agree with you that Iraq is a colony of America’s. But they don’t have any control of this country. US gov hates the Iraqi gov and its PM, but what can they do?
After 4-5 years of being in Iraq; things have got much worst and there’s nothing US could do. US is taking some financial benefits in the meantime (which will never cover the war costs) but they have no control, and the long-term pensions will not exist!
US has now a timetable to start recducing their troops in Iraq, and they’ll dfntly recuce more and more, and will leave Iraq for good, like what happened in Vietnam!
Other empires had at least some control on their colonies’ political situation and stayed there for at least few decades…!
USA’s day will come soon!
Why do you Iranians talk of wiping off countries?!!!
First Israel, and now you’re talkin of USA?! WTFFF
You can’t compare today world with 2500 years ago.
where is rome empire? where is the USSR? where is palestine? where is Yugoslavia? and son on……… it’s not something new, it’s history’s way.
History is a funny thing like when the Greeks destroyed the army of a certain king and then they finished his empire off a few years later and made their own. Persia being 75% of the civilized world at that time is total bullshit. You forget about all the other great nations of that time and get tunnel vision of a certain region using your patriotic beliefs to blind you to the truth. Egypt, the Greeks, The Chinese and many other little civilizations who are not as well known as the massive empire that Alexander the Great destroyed.
Alex,
I’m not Iranian, so no patriot stuff here.
Egypt was before Persians and Greeks.
Chinese were in the last 1000 years of the Persians.
Greeks started with Persians but ended sooner than them.
Later years of Persians; Rome empire started its existance.
Besides, the Persian empire was the longest empire ever, with 1600 years, in some periods they were the largest, and in some periods, they weren’t.
Sorry Nicole but you are wrong. The Chinese Empire began around 2000BC the earliest mention of the Persians as a people was in 844BC. The Chinese Empire is also actually the worlds longest running empire, as it is still going to this day.
The 75% idea is also well off the mark. There were civilisations in India, China (of course), as well as North Africa, Italy (the Etruscans were there long before the Romans), the Illyrians, the Dacians, Mayans in Central America, as well as others in both North and South America. Besides the ‘civilised world’ is very misleading, being civilised simply means having a developed society and culture. By that token you could also include most of Europe and Asia at that time and even the Scythians had a civilised culture and society (and also inflicted a heavy defeat on Darius the Great when the Persian Empire was at its peak).
In reality the Persian Empire at its height only controlled around 5% of the world, however they did account for around 25% of the population of the world at that time, the same as the Roman Empire.
I see your very keen to say Persians were not that good Mac! I wonder where you are from …
- Chinese is no longer an empire, for a long long time.
- Maybe 75% is misleading, but come on, 5% is [......]! Just have a look to those maps, the nations you mentioned were all tiny. Yes, maybe 5% of the whole earth, but what about the soil ground? besides, the civilised world, nor wherever was a humanbeing! How do you people give these figures out?!
Saeed why does it matter for you where people are from??????????
Hello Saeed. My intention was not to say that Persians were not that good, rather to balance the opinion and correct some inaccuracies. Persia was a great Empire and a great civilisation but it did not conquer the whole world, nor did it control 75% of the world.
The boundary for China proper is the Great Wall, other territories such as Manchuria, Xinjiang, and Tibet have been conquered and are in effect controlled territories. In Xinjiang for instance the mainly Muslim Uighurs (who are a Turkic people and distinctly different from the Chinese) have been vying for independence for years. As are the Tibetans. Just because it is a republic does not mean that it no longer an Empire. In fact the China of today is larger than under the last Emperor of the Qing Dynasty.
Again I beg to differ about the nations being tiny, the Scythian Empire for example, if it could be called that, was actually larger than the Persian Empire of the same time. China and India are both huge countries, to say they are small is simply incorrect. You could also add Xinjiang, Tibet, Mongolia and Manchuria to the civilized countries that were not under Persian control, and there are countless others.
The Persian Empire at it’s greatest extent on covered the Middle East, Asia Minor, a small portion of Eastern Europe and parts of North Africa. The 5% mark is of actual landmass on earth, that is how all other Empires are calculated, e.g. the Roman Empire was just 4%, whilst the British Empire was 25%.
The Persian Empire was a great and large empire, but no matter how you dress it up it isn’t even in the top ten biggest and when it comes to Empires size is everything. Even the US Empire was bigger than the Persian consisting of 7% of all land on earth.
Mac you know loads bout empires!
going through the last comments here, great opinions, but nobody gives any references for what they say. 75%, 5%, 4%, 7%?!!
Mac, are these for the whole world or just the civilized nations at its time? If China is an empire now, then Australia and India should also be called so! same for Britain n etc …
hey people, I think you’ve missed the whole point. WHAT IS GOING TO HAPPEN TO THE USA? … WHEN?
Hello Negah, you’re absolutely right and I apologise.
Total Landmass on earth is: 148,939,100 square km
British Empire: 36.6 million square km (25% of land on earth - rounded to nearest %)
US Empire: 10 million square km (7%)
Roman Empire: 5.7 million square km (4%)
Achaemenid Persian Empire: 7.5 million square km (5%)
All these figures are available in any encyclopaedia.
Again it is difficult to say what was civilised and what wasn’t. After all the definition of civilised is having an advanced culture and society. It was at one time thought that the Scythians and Celts were barbarians and were uncivilised. However recent evidence points to the contrary with both having their own distinct language, culture and society. So most of Europe and Asia actually was civilised as well as parts of the Americas and Africa.
Besides, the logic of that argument is flawed, otherwise the ancient Sumerian civilisation would have been the largest ever, controlling 100% of the world, as it was the only ‘civilised’ nation in the world at the time.
Technically speaking Britain is still an empire, although the former imperial possessions such as (Anguilla, Bermuda, British Antarctic Territory, British Indian Ocean Territory, British Virgin Islands, Cayman Islands, Falkland Islands, Gibraltar, Montserrat, Pitcairn Islands, Saint Helena, South Georgia and the South Sandwich Islands and the Turks and Caicos Islands) are classed as Overseas Territories now rather than possessions.
Typically an empire would be defined as a nation that has control over other nations and peoples. Neither Australia nor India really fall into that category. The US would still be classed as an empire because it conquered Hawaii and many other Pacific Islands and also had Cuba, the Philippines and others as territories at one time or another.
Go back to Iran…. It’s so frustrating to welcome people who just insult you daily.
Honestly, go home…be under the control of the mullahs.
Welcome to your brother’s site. You have a right place to look for more Bed’at among Muslims!
Alah Akbar, Khomeini Rabar!
Mohamad Javid
That is my theory. US’s end will not come with an external threat such as a military force, etc., but, it will come because of incompetence of its leader and internal breakdown of the system of laws. We are already seeing that the process has begun!
A/B/
Hey can’t answer and come up with a smart response? Do you instead tell people to leave?
I think you should leave. Who the hell are you? Anyone who is pro war and Nazi mentality is now an American? Since when? Since the idiot Bush? Fuck you little shit. You leave. My taxes probably is more than you make in a few years, so you leave ass hole. This is as much my country as it is yours and I don’t agree with you. I think Israel is better for you, since they are semi fascist and all think the same, like robots. Go there so called American. bache susul. Hey if idiots like you didn’t vote for Bush the America would be still great. But do you have balls to wear a T shirt with American Flag on it going out of this country? why the hell do you think that is? People like you are sick and you want others to leave so bunch of losers like you remain in this land? I don’t think so, YOU LEAVE. I am sick of hearing idiots like you trying to make a point by saying stupid shit like what you say. America is going down because of your type not the author or people like myself. So if you leave we will rebuild this nation to greatness that it deserves. Now shut up and go read some books or watch other things than fox news (Or fat limbough), the next time before stinking up the room with your stupidity.
but it’s just not worth it. Look, if you are sick of people telling you to go back to Iran, then you really should look at the reasons that they are saying it. Why would you expect to enter someone’s home and insult them daily? Is that the Persian way?
I have no other place to return to and I like it here. I don’t watch Fox and I am not pro Bush. I am just sick of Iranians thinking that they are better than Americans. Go can say anything you want to say so just let me tell you that Americans will get angrier and angrier with Iranians. It started with the hostage taking, which I assume everyone here supports.
No one understands why people like you are here. This is not your home and you don’t like living here. Go back to Iran.
Insulting is not the right thing to do, but nothing is wrong with criticising. Even if you’re a foreigner!
don’t get sicker, but Iranians ARE better than Americans!
Iranians are angry of Americans too and this started way earlier after US coup on Mosaddegh’s government, then planning the Noje coup, Iraq war, etc etc. what makes you care about americans angriness more than iranians?
Imam Khomeini:
به امریکا بگوئید از دست ما عصبانی باشد و از این عصبانیت بمیرد
You may start insulting as you usually do… doesn’t matter mate! go on, evacuate your self…
I have read numerous books on the Mossedegh issues. A hand full of dollars and a couple of CIA agents were able to take over the nation of Iran. Does that make sense to you? Iranians changed that government. Iranians who wanted power, money, and influence. I met the wife of a general in Savak years ago. She loved the Shah and was very happy that the Shah had regained the monarchy. Iranians love logic. Why can’t they see this fact?
Mossedegh had the same problems with the clerics that that Shah had. I think he was just worn out and when he was given the opportunity to step down he did. Mossedegh had the power to call his supporters into the streets and stop a hand full of CIA agents. Why didn’t he? What Iranians stood in the way of Demcracy in 1953?
I don’t understand why Iranians lock into one idea and fail to analyze the circumstances of events.
The Shah put clerics in jail and expelled them from Iran. The clerics were going to overthrow the Shah and he knew it.
The Iran Iraq War was a convenient cover for the cleansing of all democratic, communistic, and socialistic parties in Iran. Bush has done similar things here. Have a war and eliminate freedoms at home. Don’t you see this? It’s so obvious.
I’ll step away from this discussion, but there is no hope for understanding when you blindly blame the US for your problems in Iran. You have to look at your own history and see that Iranians have gained wealth and power by killing and inprisoning other Iranians in the past 30 years. How many people have died so that the clerics can have power?
I remember the discussions from the 1970s of Iranians in the US. They are still “bitching,” but they don’t have the gumption to do something about their concerns.
You won’t go home because you don’t have the will to change Iran. You are not brave men so you will never have the right to democracy and freedom. So sit in your Beverly Hills mansions and complain about 1953. It will do a lot of good….
- Thank you for not insulting this time. It’s a significant improvement.
- Maybe you could tell us which books you’ve read about Mosaddegh and possibly 28th Mordad.
- Make me clear, I’m a bit dense. Because some Iranians such as a Savaki’s wife wanted Shah, all people wanted Shah back? and then you know this as a sign of logic?!
- Mosaddegh had some problems with Kashani, but he gained his initial success with his help. However, Mosaddegh started becoming week after time by not paying attention to the clerics influence on ‘people’ and also becoming flexible to West and the Shah!
- Do you think Mosaddegh had the stop US? Would you say why? And also do us a favour and answer the questions you asked, because I don’t know the answer.
- Well this seems to be more blind and also childish to argue that the Iran-Iraq war was to only to cover the governments act on clearing oppositions! … How logic Iranian are!
- How do you know I/we won’t home? how do you know we don’t have the will to change Iran? My/our “change” is different from your “change”, but it’s still a change…
- I wonder who’s not brave? Maybe those who escaped the country and are sitting far away shouting “Lengesh Kon”.
- I mentioned Mosaddegh’s case an example and a case of study, not to complain. He made mistakes and now we’ve learnt from it, hopefully.
- I’m here to learn. thanks.
You thank me for not insulting when your whole discussion is an insult to Americans. You stated that Iranians ARE better than Americans. Do you not think that that statement is a huge insult to Americans? I said that the problem that I have is that Iranians think this way and you confirmed that my assumption was correct.
As Americans, we don’t feel that one ethnic group is “better” than another. I have Irish, African American, Iranian, Italian, Puerto Rican and Sioux Indian relatives. We are all the same, In the American culture it a huge cultural taboo to say that you are better than someone else. That kind of thinking comes from the KKK. Do you want Iranians to be associated with that kind of thought?
We don’t have an empire. We don’t want an empire. I think the problem with Iranians is that you would like your empire back. Killing Americans is your hope for a future? That’s what you leaders think. “Death to American!!!” We can’t ignore the rhetoric anymore.
Would you please give me the names of any American friends that you have? I would like to inform them that you are better than them. I think that would give them a good laugh.
- Last time you said you will step out of this discussion. So happy you haven’t. Thanks.
- I didn’t insult anyone. I usually don’t. And no, I don’t think stating that Iranians are better than Americans is any kind of insult. And happy your assumption is now a fact.
- Well, I have friends from all over the world too, on both cyber space and real world. I act with all them equally too. Even if you have a look to my coment responses, I’ve accused those who insult Arabs or any other race.
- The American culture respects races outside and then are against them inside. It’s somehow same in UK, Europe, Australia, etc. They have lots of lovely nice regulation against discrimination all fooling everyone well.
- Mr. American; I wonder who you care for more, Iranian or Americans. I don’t want Iranians to be known bad in any respect. But there are some things that are known bad by some cultures and not by some others. However, whenI say Iranians are better than Americans, it’s in terms of their genuine culture, history, religious, politics, behaviour, IQ, etc etc. I’m free to express my personal idea, right?
- Not me, nore the Iranian government wants anyone to be killed innocently. By the way, the slogan is”death to america” not americaN, are you cheatin on yourself?! there’s a huge difference here. The government has clearly declared that they mean the american government.
- Iran is only defending its natural and obvious rights.
- You want my American friends’ names? I don’t mind, would you like my British, Aussie, German, French, Arab, etc friends too? Because I think we’re better than them too.
I don’t think so. You make assumptions about the Americans culture because you have bias. look at what happens to a famous comedian who says a bad word about blacks. He is ostracized by everyone. The America you describe is from the fifties. You have formed an opinion and you aren’t able to adjust to the new circumstances. That is the Iranian way. I have known and lived with Iranians for 35 years and I know how they think. I am not a Mr. either.
There have been numerous articles on this site where Iranians have expressed their disdain for Arabs, Jews, and Americans. What I want you to consider is by looking down on others, you lower yourself. When you have to claim superiority, you appear to have an inferiority complex to others. Iranians appear to have a national sickness. No one can negotiate or deal fairly with them until Iranians see there is something very wrong.
I only continued my end of the discussion because you genuinely wanted to understand. You don’t understand that the US wants to help people and that we do help people. We don’t want to be policemen, but look at what happens in Rwanda when we fail to act. We tried to help the starving in Somalia and our soldiers were slaughtered while they were bringing in food. This isn’t about oil or empire. It’s about trying to help others. Iran helps…it hands out weapons and bombs to people that act as agents. It didn’t work for the US with Saddam or bin Laden. Why does Iran think this is the way to go?
I’m not, but I doubt if you are so.
What you said about Americans is actually what you (and I) wish to be! But I’m afraid to say it isn’t true.
US lied to the world, including its very own people about Iraq’s WMD. Do you want to call that part of freedom of speech?!! They started an unwanted war not because of peace, but only for pure secular purposes.